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Old 02-17-2009
 
#1
Denmark Oxygen
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Default Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

This is not a nice topic. But I believe in honesty and awareness.

Over a cup of coffee I spoke to a friend of mine about aesthetics of women and what we found attractive. Now what I find faschinating is if there is a universal beauty or if our genes and culture create an image of beauty.
The answer probably lies in between the two. However my hypothesis is that inside our core we seek a beautiful woman without flaws, but due to the fact that many can't get such a woman one starts distorting the image.
I will give you an example. Some people like morbitly obese women or women who are missing a limb, Why is this? Well it must have roots in evolution. The more a man fails at attracting women the more flawed women he will seek. And will most likely see the situation from a pespective where he has not failed. For example. "I like girls with extremly hairy arms and legs. Is just so animalistic. I guess I am more intune with humanities true animalistic side than the rest of the world. Who wants a fake barbie anyway? Hairy girls. Yum yum. The rest of you are sick!".
Now what I find unhealthy about this attitude is that a person changes failure to success at the cost of being honest to himself and stops himself from getting what he truly seeks.
How do you feel about this hypothesis? And to what degree does it influence us? To what degree does it influence you? Is perversion and subjectivity in women a weakness?
 
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Old 02-17-2009
 
#2
United States Luther Stark
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Default Re: Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

Quote:
Now what I find faschinating is if there is a universal beauty or if our genes and culture create an image of beauty.
I would have a hard to accepting the idea of a "universal" beauty. The word strikes me as inherently subjective.

Quote:
However my hypothesis is that inside our core we seek a beautiful woman without flaws, but due to the fact that many can't get such a woman one starts distorting the image.
I also have a difficult time believing that our 'core' nature is to seek out women on the primary basis of physical attractiveness. It seems to me that females have alot more to offer than the appearance of their bodies.

Quote:
Some people like morbitly obese women or women who are missing a limb, Why is this?
My instinct here is that these people don't find people who have these faults especially physically attractive. Rather, they are attracted to people who have physical flaws for reasons that, again, are not related to physical beauty. For example, a person may be insecure about their weight and they may find that being attracted to a person who is overweight allows them to get overcome their insecurities.

Quote:
The more a man fails at attracting women the more flawed women he will seek.
I think this is similar to my above point. But we shouldn't make hte mistake of thinking that this pattern of behavior is either necessary or adapative. Rather, it strikes me as avoidable and frankly maladaptive.

Quote:
Now what I find unhealthy about this attitude is that a person changes failure to success at the cost of being honest to himself and stops himself from getting what he truly seeks.
Again, I think my above point agrees with this conclusion, although I would be careful not to infer what exactly it is that the person 'truely seeks'.
 

Last edited by Luther Stark; 02-17-2009 at 04:42 AM.
 

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Old 02-17-2009
 
#3
Denmark Oxygen
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Default Re: Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Luther Stark View Post
I also have a difficult time believing that our 'core' nature is to seek out women on the primary basis of physical attractiveness. It seems to me that females have alot more to offer than the appearance of their bodies.
Agreed. Personality is important. This also makes sense from an evolutionary standpoint. This post does focus slightly on psycical attractiveness since it is more tangible and easier to discuss.
 
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Old 02-17-2009
 
#4
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Default Re: Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

I disagree Oxygen.

It's a commonly used statement that you guys often look for women who are similar in many ways to their own mothers. By that I mean, we look for things that are familiar to us. If we grew up with an overly attractive mother we may look for an overly attractive woman, the same thing goes for a bitchy mother/bitchy woman. Now I'm going to add to that and say we might look for the exact OPPOSITE should the relationship with our parents be strained.

I think where you are right is that people have a preconceived notion that attractive women are either A: less smart or B: more self centered/selfish/needy/etc. This I think is where your theory rings true. We may downgrade the attractiveness of a potential partner because we feel that going after the 'dime piece' to quote an old roommate is going to lead to a lot of pricy restaurant bills where as you can get an 8 to go dutch. If you catch my drift.

However as for the argument about disfigurements I think that perhaps if someone was touched at some point by maybe a television show/family members injury/etc. that caused a debilitating injury they may be fascinated by it. And that fascination may translate to at first to the perception of attraction and perhaps eventually actual attraction to said injury.

Think of it this way, very few people are turned on by pregnant women inherently. Sure we may appreciate what preggo's are going through but very rarely is a man who is single and has never had a child attracted to pregnant women or looking up pregnant porn on a regular basis. Or at least I hope not :\ However once my girlfriend became pregnant I began to find that I would look at pregnant women in a different light. Don't get me wrong I didn't become some pregnant chick predator or pop a boner every time I saw one but I definitely found that I found pregnant women to be very beautiful (notice I didn't say I was attracted to them, it was more an appreciation.)

I think it really is in the eye of the beholder and it isn't so much a lowering of standards and here is why. My feeling is that guys who don't get laid, especially in the internet era. Guys who have faced rejection countless times and have 0 self esteem. Begin to resort to what many men resort to - porn - for their needs. This creates a false image of what a woman should be, either A: very busty, very curvy, nymphomatic women, or B: very innocent, very tiny, very teenage looking girls. Neither of whom are the norm, so instead of lowering their standards it stands to reason that the standard would increase. These are the same type of men who can be found stalking celebrities, buying very expensive seats for them and their children to the Cheetah Girls/Britney Spears/Katy Perry/Lady Gaga/Rihanna/etc. shows.

Anyways the point I'm trying to make is I don't think many people do let their standards slip, instead I think people will be attracted to their 'type' but at the same time stronger attraction can occasionally happen to someone who wouldn't seem so obvious who they share a strong chemistry with, which is why friends and coworkers date so often.
 
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Old 02-17-2009
 
#5
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Default Re: Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

The sole idea that really "hot" women attract so much attention from so many different sides even if they have a partner just kills it for me. I'm not going to have to 1-up every sucker that comes by for the rest of my life. That's not how I want to live my life. All these assholes who marry extremely beautiful women that are high-maintenance end up getting cheated on, because these women can get so much more from other men, new things every time. They get bored easily.

It's a trend I've observed, and it just really kills it for me. On the other hand, I'd love to bang one of them, if she doesn't look completely plastic that is. And if she keeps her mouth shut. Nothing turns me off more about a woman than when she opens her mouth and she's a total ditz. Duhhhhhhhhhrrrr....
 

Last edited by p3ngu!n; 02-17-2009 at 08:30 PM.
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Old 02-17-2009
 
#6
United States Golgo 13
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Default Re: Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

Quote:
Originally Posted by p3ngu!n View Post
The sole idea that really "hot" women attract so much attention from so many different sides even if they have a partner just kills it for me. I'm not going to have to 1-up every sucker that comes by for the rest of my life. That's not how I want to live my life. All these assholes who marry extremely beautiful women that are high-maintenance end up getting cheated on, because these women can get so much more from mother men, new things every time. They get bored easily.

It's a trend I've observed, and it just really kills it for me.
Yeah, this is why you need to find some nice girl that isn't full of herself.

Trophies can be nice to have from time to time, but they're almost always transient affairs at best. If you're looking for something more, then you need to avoid the type of person that will keep you running around in circles since it ultimately ends up with the guy sinking in a swamp of endless unreasonable expectations and getting used until something better comes along.

That shit gets old pretty fast.
 
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Old 02-17-2009
 
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United States The Hawaiian
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Default Re: Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

Beauty is entirely subjective. I think societies shape our attitudes and views on beauty. For example in earlier times "attractive" women then would be considered obese by todays standard. The ideal of a skinny woman is a modern concept. Also, consider the cultural standard in African nations that put that wierd ring shit on their lips, they consider this to be beautiful, but I sure as hell don't.

Also looks aren't everything. I myself am more attracted towards "good" girls, it adds another sense of beauty that can't really be described right now because I got a good buzz.

Oh and as for trophy wives, fuck em. Any bitch who is in it for the money can go eat shit. I don't see how someone could marry somebody like this. Fuck? Yeah ok, but marry? Damn, your an idiot.
 
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Old 02-17-2009
 
#8
Denmark Oxygen
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Default Re: Attraction - Subjective or Re-Framing?

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I think societies shape our attitudes and views on beauty.
Agreed

Quote:
Originally Posted by The Hawaiian View Post
Beauty is entirely subjective.
Subjective yes. But not entirely. I like girls with two eyes. How many eyes should a girl have to attract you the most? Beauty is subjective, but we will find ourselves agreeing on a lot of traits that we both desire in women.
 
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