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StarCraft Discussion StarCraft & Brood War lie herein.

View Poll Results: The units stat should be...
Damage per Shot, like Starcraft 14 45.16%
Damage per Second 1 3.23%
Depends on the unit 9 29.03%
Try to show both 5 16.13%
None, people should have to guess muwhahahaha! 2 6.45%
Voters: 31. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 06-19-2007
 
#1
Australia Operational
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Question Damage per Second or per Shot?

In Starcraft and indeed most games unit damage is listed as for "per shot", so a Marine does 6 damage per shot. But I occasionally wonder if Damage per Second might be a more useful stat to display since it also takes into account a units attack rate. Now the obvious downside to displaying damage per second is that it makes it harder to take armor into the equation, but what about "beam laser" units like the Colossus which has no obvious individual attack?

On a slightly related note I think a units damage type and size category (assuming this mechanic is kept) should also be displayed in game along with any other relevant unit information/statistic.
 

Last edited by Operational; 06-19-2007 at 02:59 AM.
 

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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

They're really not that different if you think about it. You can average it out and make damage per shot the same as damage over time. The only difference between the units that have cooldowns and the units that don't are the way it looks to the user. In either case, the unit will be doing a certain amount of damage over time during attack sequence.

This will likely make a big difference in micromanagement, however, since units that can shoot and scoot rather than have to hold still and focus on a target can get their damage in without having to remain stationary.
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

i think it should be based on the unit

like if you look at the siege tank there was a second or 2 between each shot
so you would have to divide the amount of damage by 2 or 3 which really doesnt show accurately how the siege tank works

but a unit like the collossus, its single shot lasts for several seconds so if you were gonna show its stat as per shot you would have to add up all the damage it could do if it fired till it stopped to cool down and add up all the damage it dealt
this also doesnt really show accurately how the collosus works
because it could be like 200 per shot

so i think it should be based on the type of attack it has
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

how about show both? i mean there is more screen space today anyway.
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

well i suppose you could just that it people might get confused on which is which
and also for some units some stats would be outrages and might mke people not to want to buy the unit
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Kinda off topic her but whats the zealot damage gonna be like now? I mean, in the original, the zealot did 16 base damage which when he attacked actualy did 8 damage per blade which where used in quick succesion. But judging from all the gameplay trailers the zealot only kinda attacks once per strike. So is he still gonna have a per-blade attack of 8 base damage or is each blade strike gonna do 16 base damage?
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Carsickness View Post
Kinda off topic her but whats the zealot damage gonna be like now? I mean, in the original, the zealot did 16 base damage which when he attacked actualy did 8 damage per blade which where used in quick succesion. But judging from all the gameplay trailers the zealot only kinda attacks once per strike. So is he still gonna have a per-blade attack of 8 base damage or is each blade strike gonna do 16 base damage?
i actually think they might change the way zealots attack seems to sluggish
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Depend of units.

Obviously the Warp Ray cannot dealt damage per shot becouse it dealt only an unic laser shot, so per second. Right?

Zergling per shot.

Phoenix per shot.

Marine per shot.

Colussus per second.

Ecc...
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

A very easy way is to also display the units time between attacks when you mouse over the weapon, in addition to damage, damage type and range.

Also when you mouse over the armor it should show the armor type and the speed of the unit in addition to its base armor.

This way showing dps is redundant since you can easily calculate it yourself, and i dont think that even the "Pro gamers" will object to this since the inormation is readily aviable to anyone anyway.
 
 

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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Operational View Post
In Starcraft and indeed most games unit damage is listed as for "per shot", so a Marine does 6 damage per shot. But I occasionally wonder if Damage per Second might be a more useful stat to display since it also takes into account a units attack rate. Now the obvious downside to displaying damage per second is that it makes it harder to take armor into the equation, but what about "beam laser" units like the Colossus which has no obvious individual attack?

On a slightly related note I think a units damage type and size category (assuming this mechanic is kept) should also be displayed in game along with any other relevant unit information/statistic.
I'm 99.7% sure that "damage per second" was also listed in the SC strategy guide (the other.3% would be possible if I had the guide in front of me right now). This isn't all that helpful anyway, since most games are played on "fast", or "faster", or "fastest", which would all skew that damage-per-second reading.

Displaying too much information about units in-game would be excessive and ugly. If players want to know the size and armor type of a unit (and other types of info), they can either experiment in-game, or look the facts up in a strategy guide.

*Edit*: Damage cannot be listed "per shot" for the beam attackers like the Soul Hunter, Warp Ray, and Star Relic. I'm dissapointed in all of the people who voted "damage per shot"; please learn the basic mechanics of the game if you are going to vote on it; if you do that, this forum will be even better .
 

Last edited by Admiral Xidlir; 06-19-2007 at 09:05 AM.
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Admiral Xidlir View Post
I'm 99.7% sure that "damage per second" was also listed in
Displaying too much information about units in-game would be excessive and ugly. If players want to know the size and armor type of a unit (and other types of info), they can either experiment in-game, or look the facts up in a strategy guide.
Ehum, it wouldnt be cluttered at all, it would be just like starcraft is now but when you mouse over the wepp/armor you get all the information about it rather than just the armor value or damage per shot. Its not hard at all to do, it wont clutter the screen in any way, it wont distract anyone at all and theres no reason at all to not do it.
Quote:
*Edit*: Damage cannot be listed "per shot" for the beam attackers like the Soul Hunter, Warp Ray, and Star Relic. I'm dissapointed in all of the people who voted "damage per shot"; please learn the basic mechanics of the game if you are going to vote on it; if you do that, this forum will be even better .
Um, ofcourse damage can be listed per shot depending on the unit. For example it could look like this:
When mousing over a marines weapon:
Damage: 6+1
Range: 4+1
Time between attacks: 7.5 (15-7.5)
Damage type: Normal, 100% vs everything.

When mousing over a warprays weapon:
Damage: 20 dps
(or 20+20dps when it got 2 rays etc) Also its counted in ingame seconds, not actual realtime seconds since those vary with settings and lagg.
Range: 6
Damage type: Explosive, 100% vs large, 75% vs medium, 50% vs small.

Dont think so restrictive with the UI, these things are really easy to do and dont have to be limites such as starcrafts ui.
 
 

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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Admiral Xidlir View Post
most games are played on "fast", or "faster", or "fastest", which would all skew that damage-per-second reading.
Good point, perhaps "Damage per Time Unit" (DPTU, DTU) or "Damage per Time Interval" (DPTI, DTI) or even "Damage per Second Providing You Play On The Fastest Setting" (DPSPYPOTFS).

Anyway, at this stage, it is the concept that really matters not the implementation.
 
 

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Old 06-19-2007
 
#13
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

But, the Warpray does more damage the longer it shoots at a single target. So they would have to have some sort of equation with 'x' being the length of time it has been shooting at the target or something.

That brings me to another question. When the Warprays shoot, does the amount of damage they inflict per second go up steadily or does it get exponentially stronger per second?
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Personally, I'd much prefer having both damage per second and damage per shot listed. That gives the player the best info that they're going to get.

Though admittedly, who actually looks ingame at how much damage their units do? Those numbers get memorized fast, in my experience.
 
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Old 06-19-2007
 
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Default Re: Damage per Second or per Shot?

Damage per second is irrelevent in too many situations, mostly due to damage mitigation from armor, and from weapon types.
 
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